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level with us about his tax plan which gives the wealthy huge new tax breaks? if we can't trust him here, how could we ever trust him here? >> the romney campaign has taken issue of course with what the obama campaign uses which is a tax policy center analysis. in that ad that draws on the -- to argue that mitt romney's tax plan depends on a $5 trillion tax cut that's not paid for. the conclusion they drew is the only way you offset those tax cuts over ten years, after handcuffing yourself on the pledges that romney has made to reduce tax rates across the board by 20% eliminating the alternative minimum tax and erasing the federal estate tax is to eliminate deductions that will inevitably touch the middle class. the romney folks say the obama campaign and tax policy center created a strawman. the problem is the romney campaign hasn't created their own and responded with any detail on how they would do it. it becomes impossible at least politically once you account for the pledge handcuffs that romney has made. while the president didn't fully acknowledge he cam
level with us about his tax plan which gives the wealthy huge new tax breaks? if we can't trust him here, how could we ever trust him here? >> the romney campaign has taken issue of course with what the obama campaign uses which is a tax policy center analysis. in that ad that draws on the -- to argue that mitt romney's tax plan depends on a $5 trillion tax cut that's not paid for. the conclusion they drew is the only way you offset those tax cuts over ten years, after handcuffing...
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who pays taxes ought to get tax relief. a of my plan is in place the wealthiest americans will pay a higher percentage of taxes than they do today and the poorest of americans, 6 million families, 7 million people won't pay any tax at all. >> notice the slight of hands. the wealthiest americans will pay a higher percentage of taxes than they do today. not a higher percentage of their income in taxes since that would be an outright lie. very common bit of conservative bit of misdirection used to hide the distributional tax cuts they're proposing. for instance, even in herman cain's explicitly progressive world of a 9/9/9 flat tax, you can imagine the wealthiest households would still pay a majority of total income tax revenue. that doesn't reflect how progressive or fair the taxation system is. it reflects just how unequal incomes are. bush did it again in the next debate too. >> my plan is that the wealthy people pay 62% of the taxes today after which they pay 64%. this is a fair plan. you know why? because the tax code is
who pays taxes ought to get tax relief. a of my plan is in place the wealthiest americans will pay a higher percentage of taxes than they do today and the poorest of americans, 6 million families, 7 million people won't pay any tax at all. >> notice the slight of hands. the wealthiest americans will pay a higher percentage of taxes than they do today. not a higher percentage of their income in taxes since that would be an outright lie. very common bit of conservative bit of misdirection...
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federal income tax, federal payroll tax, state income tax, state sales tax, state property tax, gasoline tax -- it added up to well over 50% of what they earned. and your plan is to take the tax rate on successful small businesses from 35% to 40%. the national federation of independent businesses has said that will cost 700,000 jobs. i don't want to cost jobs. my priority is jobs. and so what i do is i bring down the tax rates, lower deductions and exemptions, the same idea behind bowles simpson, by the way. get the rates down, lower deductions and exemptions, to create more jobs, because there's nothing better for getting us to a balanced budget than having more people working, earning more money, paying more taxes. that's by far the most effective and efficient way to get this budget balanced. >> jim, you may want to move on to another topic, but i would just say this to the american people. if you believe that we can cut taxes by $5 trillion and add $2 trillion in additional spending that the military is not asking for, $7 trillion, just to give you a sense, over ten years, that's mor
federal income tax, federal payroll tax, state income tax, state sales tax, state property tax, gasoline tax -- it added up to well over 50% of what they earned. and your plan is to take the tax rate on successful small businesses from 35% to 40%. the national federation of independent businesses has said that will cost 700,000 jobs. i don't want to cost jobs. my priority is jobs. and so what i do is i bring down the tax rates, lower deductions and exemptions, the same idea behind bowles...
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he says he's going to lower tax rates but eliminate corporate tax loopholes and personal tax loopholes. i think he has a secret plan to eliminate that tax critical to the middle class. >> do you think that's what viewers walked away thinking? >> i think they walked away thinking mitt romney would be a great used car salesman, but the policies he's articulating will get us right back into the mess that president obama has been working so hard to dig us out of. >> i suspect many walked away last night feeling a bit confused, maybe a bit bored by the technical language and lack of passion. and they are possibly asking the question around the world that many are, which is why can't these guys get together to hammer out a fiscal solution? because actually they were talking about the details, they didn't seem to be so incredibly so far apart on many of the issues. >> were they? >> i was just thinking just now it is too bad steve israel couldn't go out with an obama mask and substitute for the president. there are a lot of points you are making last night that the president missed. >> what wa
he says he's going to lower tax rates but eliminate corporate tax loopholes and personal tax loopholes. i think he has a secret plan to eliminate that tax critical to the middle class. >> do you think that's what viewers walked away thinking? >> i think they walked away thinking mitt romney would be a great used car salesman, but the policies he's articulating will get us right back into the mess that president obama has been working so hard to dig us out of. >> i suspect many...
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everybody would like a tax cut. who wouldn't want a tax cut, especially 20% across the board? if you're making 35%, the top rate, you go to 28%. all chris wallace was trying to get from ryan on sunday was just tell me what big deductions you're going to get rid of so we can finance that. it's the question. of course everybody wants a tax cut, but if it's not going to cause bigger deficits, tell us how you're going to do it, and they won't do it. they won't say we're going to get rid of charitable deductions, won't get rid of homeowner, state and local. that's where all the money is. it's not little doodads here. joan, you take this one. he won't tell us. same question comes up wednesday night, can romney dodgeball it? can he say i'm not telling you how i'm going to do the major thing i promised to do, get the economy going through a tax cut, but i'm not going to tell you how i'm going to do it. can he get away with it with even the -- >> i hope not. i think this is a moment for jim lehrer to be very tough, respectful tough, and for president obama to come back at him and to sa
everybody would like a tax cut. who wouldn't want a tax cut, especially 20% across the board? if you're making 35%, the top rate, you go to 28%. all chris wallace was trying to get from ryan on sunday was just tell me what big deductions you're going to get rid of so we can finance that. it's the question. of course everybody wants a tax cut, but if it's not going to cause bigger deficits, tell us how you're going to do it, and they won't do it. they won't say we're going to get rid of...
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>> if you extend the bush tax cuts you don't cut taxes you keep taxes where they are. if you don't extend the bush tax cuts you raise taxes. if you don't extend the bush tax cuts in total you raise taxes. >> they're set to expire. it was your party that set them to expire. i would add. i wasn't -- sitting here at the desk i didn't do that the republican party was the one that decided to do that so you guys had to deal with the sunset provision. >> it's not an accounting measure. they're going to -- of course it's an accounting measure. >> i pay a certain level of tax this career. next year if the bush tax cuts expire i get a big tax increase but if the bush tax cuts don't expire i pay the same tax next year the same as i do this year. >> because you make a lot of money. mr. giuliani, you have a very large tax cut because you are, to your great credit, a high-earning individual and you'll see a large bounty from the tax cut. that's the question on the table. >> stop the ad silliness. the reality is it's true for everyone. let me finish my answer, rather than yelling and
>> if you extend the bush tax cuts you don't cut taxes you keep taxes where they are. if you don't extend the bush tax cuts you raise taxes. if you don't extend the bush tax cuts in total you raise taxes. >> they're set to expire. it was your party that set them to expire. i would add. i wasn't -- sitting here at the desk i didn't do that the republican party was the one that decided to do that so you guys had to deal with the sunset provision. >> it's not an accounting...
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a candidate says i'm going to lower the tax rates but i'm going to broaden the tax base. what you get is lower rates, you get a lot of the former, you get very little of the latter. because like bob says, once you start going into how you're going to broaden the base, then it's don't look at me, look at the other guy. so the danger of this tax reform trap that governor romney is trying to sell right now is that you're going to end up with massively lower tax rates and you're not going to broaden the base much at all such that you'll have an explosive budget deficit, it's very much what we saw in the bush supply side trickle down years. >> bob, debatess left. the vice presidential debate, the town hall presidential debate and then the debate on foreign policy. >> i think we throw out the myth that somehow or other only the first debates matter. i think the other debates will have big audiences. i'm through with the expectations game. i think vice president biden will do very well next week. i think the president will bring his best game to these next two debates. this guy
a candidate says i'm going to lower the tax rates but i'm going to broaden the tax base. what you get is lower rates, you get a lot of the former, you get very little of the latter. because like bob says, once you start going into how you're going to broaden the base, then it's don't look at me, look at the other guy. so the danger of this tax reform trap that governor romney is trying to sell right now is that you're going to end up with massively lower tax rates and you're not going to...
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by tax expenditures. >> he also said he would not sign any tax deal. >> that's true. that's why you have the upsets that he's talking about. it's not going to be easy. it took three years to do it in the 1986 tax bill. it's not going to be easy here. i have to say, he outlined three ways to deal with trying to reduce the debt. he took one of them off there. you have to deal with two sides here. no taxes to deal with the deficit. is that the right thing? >> keep in mind, he made it very clear that unlike this president, who i have to like as a person. i know him well. unlike president obama, he wants to work with congress. he knows he's not going to get anything done if he doesn't work with congress. >> but he drew a line there. is that a fuzzy line? >> i'm with it on the line. one thing that has to be made very clear is the wealthy will be paying just as much as they're paying now. >> but they shouldn't pay more. >> i thought one of the best lines is that basically we're tired of trickle down government. and he turned the tables on the president. we have the president
by tax expenditures. >> he also said he would not sign any tax deal. >> that's true. that's why you have the upsets that he's talking about. it's not going to be easy. it took three years to do it in the 1986 tax bill. it's not going to be easy here. i have to say, he outlined three ways to deal with trying to reduce the debt. he took one of them off there. you have to deal with two sides here. no taxes to deal with the deficit. is that the right thing? >> keep in mind, he...
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that's not a tax raise. that's called fairness where i come from. >> vice president biden, congressman paul ryan are prepping if for their own debate next thursday at center college in danville, kentucky. >>> the united nations security council is condemning the shelling by syrian forces in a turkey down that killed women and children. turkey's military responded with artillery fire, raising the prospect of a wider conflict between the two nations. syria remains locked in a brutal civil war that's killed an estimated 30,000 people since march of last year. for more on this potentially explosive situation along the border, we turn to nbc's amon. he's live on the phone from turkey. reset this story for us, if you would, this morning. what happened initially, and where are we now? >> reporter: well, it began on wednesday afternoon when the syrian military essentially fired on this town that was on the syrian side of the border, but according to some, they overshot. one of the mortars landed in the turkish town
that's not a tax raise. that's called fairness where i come from. >> vice president biden, congressman paul ryan are prepping if for their own debate next thursday at center college in danville, kentucky. >>> the united nations security council is condemning the shelling by syrian forces in a turkey down that killed women and children. turkey's military responded with artillery fire, raising the prospect of a wider conflict between the two nations. syria remains locked in a...
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tax havens. mitt romney avoided paying his fair share. what else is he hiding? >>> joining me now, david k johnston author of the new book, "the fine print" and karen finney. david k. johnstone, the times got tax experts to look at the tax returns and some documents they obtained from bain from this new report today. what did we learn? >> well, the cayman islands 4 hundred years ago was a hang out for pirates now it's a hang out for tax pirates. instead of a buried map of where the tresh is, now you get this opinion letters from lawyer, if you follow one every one of these steps, you can get your treasure untaxed to the cayman islands. one of the things the times points out because of the way these were set up and the fees they were charged against them, the less taxes paid by those who were investing, the greater the sum available and therefore the higher the fees that romney collected. >> karen finney, romney, you get the sense the romney campaign expected that the tax return story was a story
tax havens. mitt romney avoided paying his fair share. what else is he hiding? >>> joining me now, david k johnston author of the new book, "the fine print" and karen finney. david k. johnstone, the times got tax experts to look at the tax returns and some documents they obtained from bain from this new report today. what did we learn? >> well, the cayman islands 4 hundred years ago was a hang out for pirates now it's a hang out for tax pirates. instead of a buried map...
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tax cuts. a guy who says we shouldn't be having mission creep in libya but wants mission creep in syria. he's been on all sides of the issues. >> that's just in the last week. >> the president needs to just say these things, it's not obvious to people watching on tv. when you're in a debate it's helpful to talk about it at that time rather than in the rallies afterwards. the jobs question is very interesting. he's trying to convince people in ohio where the unemployment rate is lower than the national average, which already is coming down -- >> in a place where the president's plan to save the auto industry actually protected many jobs. >> so in the face of all the evidence around them, and you can argue about economic statistics as much as you like, but people know their own economy and their own lives. he's trying to put against that by saying there are joshs in the ground we will dig up presumagely by pulling away from environmental regulations. he's talking really about fracking. that's his
tax cuts. a guy who says we shouldn't be having mission creep in libya but wants mission creep in syria. he's been on all sides of the issues. >> that's just in the last week. >> the president needs to just say these things, it's not obvious to people watching on tv. when you're in a debate it's helpful to talk about it at that time rather than in the rallies afterwards. the jobs question is very interesting. he's trying to convince people in ohio where the unemployment rate is...
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of these tax cuts. but romney didn't need to address any of these specifics. he just needed to lie about it. it's a strategy another president used when he was asked about his proposed tax cuts for the rich. >> let me just tell you what the facts are. the facts are, after my plan, the wealthiest of americans pay more taxes of the percentage of the whole than they do today. >> really? here we go again. a republican candidate has a plan for massive tax cuts for the rich and tells the american people the exact opposite in a debate. it only works if the candidate is a good liar. presentation does matter. give him credit. last night mitt romney was pretty good on style, but he had a boat load of lies. check out this triple whammy where romney spits out one lie after another with complete conviction. >> we didn't raise taxes. you've raised them by $1 trillion under obama care. we didn't cut medicare, of course, we don't have medicare, but we didn't cut medicare by $716 billion. we didn't put in place a board
of these tax cuts. but romney didn't need to address any of these specifics. he just needed to lie about it. it's a strategy another president used when he was asked about his proposed tax cuts for the rich. >> let me just tell you what the facts are. the facts are, after my plan, the wealthiest of americans pay more taxes of the percentage of the whole than they do today. >> really? here we go again. a republican candidate has a plan for massive tax cuts for the rich and tells the...
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for every american that pays taxes, if the bush tax cuts expire, their taxes go up. president obama wants to vary that for people at $250,000, that's just the reality of it. >> this is a very important point about the distributional impacts of our tax policy. my understanding is that there had been a difference between mitt romney and the president. that mitt romney wants to make sure he preserves the tax cuts for those at the high end and the president doesn't want to. i want to establish for people watching that is still the case. >> of course it is. mitt romney wants to extend the bush tax cuts -- >> for high income earners. >> for everyone. if you leave those alone, there's no tax increase. if you get rid of the tax cuts for anybody, there will be an increase. the government is wasting enough money already. i believe in the ronald reagan approach -- if i can finish my answer, you should not feed the beast. let's put the beast on a diet and spend a little less money. >> did the department of homeland security, does that count as feeding the beast or not? >> i have
for every american that pays taxes, if the bush tax cuts expire, their taxes go up. president obama wants to vary that for people at $250,000, that's just the reality of it. >> this is a very important point about the distributional impacts of our tax policy. my understanding is that there had been a difference between mitt romney and the president. that mitt romney wants to make sure he preserves the tax cuts for those at the high end and the president doesn't want to. i want to...
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he has a tax cut. if you implemented it, what he says though, and has said from the beginning is that he will pay for that tax cut. when you include that sentence, he then says fairly scored, i have promised as a later date to pay for it. the question has been how are you going to pay for it? why should we believe you when no republican in 20 or 30 years has paid for a tax cut. i'm not sure it is wrong for romney to say that he is going to do a $5 trillion tax cut. the problem is he hasn't told us a word about how he is going to pay for it. the three things he wants to do, have the 20% across the board rate cut and have it paid for while protecting a bunch of tax cuts, they can't be done at once. something has to give and we don't know what it will be. >> he is wrong. because, if we give them the allowance that you are willing to give him, that will be the first time in the history of the discussion of tax policy in our government that anyone has been able to say i don't have a $5 trillion tax cut beca
he has a tax cut. if you implemented it, what he says though, and has said from the beginning is that he will pay for that tax cut. when you include that sentence, he then says fairly scored, i have promised as a later date to pay for it. the question has been how are you going to pay for it? why should we believe you when no republican in 20 or 30 years has paid for a tax cut. i'm not sure it is wrong for romney to say that he is going to do a $5 trillion tax cut. the problem is he hasn't told...
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the estate tax. we'll give the top 1/10 of taxpayers an average break of $250,000. >> look, look, andrea, mitt romney pointed out that one of the things that he would do is to put a cap on the deductions. the tax policy center admitted that what they analyzed was assumptions they added to mitt romney's plan that are not deduction. >> which deductions. >> let me finish. i let you finish. now let me fin. >> yes, sir. >> the tax policy center admitted that they made assumptions that were not part of mitt romney's tax plan. there are six or seven follow-up studies that say romney's tax plan can do what the governor has said he would. he's going to eliminate or cap deductions on upper income brackets there is more enough in the basket of choices there to take care of providing the to 20% tax reduction to the middle class. >> no, there are not. >> with all due respect to what obama people are putting out, they're wrong on it. >> i'm not talking about what the obama people are talking. first of all, those a
the estate tax. we'll give the top 1/10 of taxpayers an average break of $250,000. >> look, look, andrea, mitt romney pointed out that one of the things that he would do is to put a cap on the deductions. the tax policy center admitted that what they analyzed was assumptions they added to mitt romney's plan that are not deduction. >> which deductions. >> let me finish. i let you finish. now let me fin. >> yes, sir. >> the tax policy center admitted that they made...
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, like your home mortgage tax deduction, in the romney/ryan tax plan. not enough time. they can't even say if you will pay more or less with their tax plan. well, mitt, i'm sure president obama will give you as many of his minutes as you need to explain it all in wednesday night's debate. >> mitt romney needs a great october. >> we know romney needs a great october. >> to change the course of this campaign. >> the final push is on. >> just days away from the first presidential debate. >> both candidates cramming for the first debate. >> everyone trying to lower expectations. >> franticly spinning to lower expectations. >> >> president obama is an experienced debatetor. >> i'm just okay. >> almost everyone seems to be muting enthusiasm in trying to undersell thvernlths is mitt's first time. >> i don't buy that. >> chris christie is taking a different tack. >> we have a candidate who is going to do extraordinary well on wednesday night. come thursday morning when we get to thursday morning, the entire narrative of this race is going to change. >> this is
, like your home mortgage tax deduction, in the romney/ryan tax plan. not enough time. they can't even say if you will pay more or less with their tax plan. well, mitt, i'm sure president obama will give you as many of his minutes as you need to explain it all in wednesday night's debate. >> mitt romney needs a great october. >> we know romney needs a great october. >> to change the course of this campaign. >> the final push is on. >> just days away from the first...
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what about this tax plan. is president obama obligated to supporters to point out to them that this is flawed? what do you think? >> i think the moderators are going e to ask governor romney about a lot of the things that you just talked about. i hope the moderator gives governor romney a chance to do what paul ryan said he didn't have time to do and that is explain how they pay for a $5 trillion tax cut. as you pointed out, ed, it is a time problem that is vexing in this budget. it's a math problem. they can't pay for it. if they can't pay for it, then they are going to raise taxes on the middle class. that's what the economic studies have shown. and look, i don't know anybody who thinks we're another tax cut for a millionaire away from a stronger middle class. that's just not how we have built our economy before and it's not how we're going to continue to make our country strong now. >> will president obama confront romney on these issues or rely on the debate moderator to do it? how aggressive will the pres
what about this tax plan. is president obama obligated to supporters to point out to them that this is flawed? what do you think? >> i think the moderators are going e to ask governor romney about a lot of the things that you just talked about. i hope the moderator gives governor romney a chance to do what paul ryan said he didn't have time to do and that is explain how they pay for a $5 trillion tax cut. as you pointed out, ed, it is a time problem that is vexing in this budget. it's a...
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the number on his tax cut is $5 trillion. because he's talking about a 20% cut in marginal rates, eliminating the alternative minimum tax, estate tax and other deductions, $480 billion a year, $5 trillion over ten years, that's the number. then he says, you know, every day for the last 18 months, i've been talking about repealing every aspect of obama care, but actually i didn't mean it. well it's too late for that. if you repeal obama care across the board, that means that kids can no longer stay on their parents' coverage through age 26, it means that we can go back to a system of denying coverage for preexisting conditions, it means that seniors again are back on to co-pays larger co-pays as it relates to prescription drugs, and on dodd/frank, he's been saying he wants to repeal dodd/frank, andrea, every day for the last 18 months, repeal every aspect of it. dodd/frank of course is the bill that reregulated the financial system after the credit market collapsed, the catastrophic collapse of 2008. so does anybody really wan
the number on his tax cut is $5 trillion. because he's talking about a 20% cut in marginal rates, eliminating the alternative minimum tax, estate tax and other deductions, $480 billion a year, $5 trillion over ten years, that's the number. then he says, you know, every day for the last 18 months, i've been talking about repealing every aspect of obama care, but actually i didn't mean it. well it's too late for that. if you repeal obama care across the board, that means that kids can no longer...
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there aren't enough tax loopholes or tax deductions to pay for romney's tax cut unless you cut into home interest mortgage deductions, unless you get rid of state and local taxes. that will hit the middle class hard. you have to be honest about this. the debate hurt obama and helped romney, and romney's gotten a bump in the polls, although it seems to be flattening out. you look at the new poll in ohio, the president is at 51%, ronl is at 47%. i think the president, the fundamental structure of the race hasn't been changed, but if he doesn't go on the attack, if biden doesn't do a good job against ryan, and if the president doesn't show up and isn't strong in the second debate, then you're going to have a tossup race. >> well, i would disagree with your approach, first of all. i don't approach that way. that's going back and relate gating all the old arguments. in spirit what i would do unlike shrumy, i would take the big issue that is separate the candidates, don't get into the little trench warfare about what's your tax plan and where were you on medicare two weeks ago. i would say whe
there aren't enough tax loopholes or tax deductions to pay for romney's tax cut unless you cut into home interest mortgage deductions, unless you get rid of state and local taxes. that will hit the middle class hard. you have to be honest about this. the debate hurt obama and helped romney, and romney's gotten a bump in the polls, although it seems to be flattening out. you look at the new poll in ohio, the president is at 51%, ronl is at 47%. i think the president, the fundamental structure of...
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to do to the tax code. he has a tax cut that would cost $5 trillion. that part is true. the president is right about that. romney said from the very beginning, he's consistent so nothing he said last night was new. it's important to put that clearly. he's always said he will pay for that tax cut. that tax cut will not be passed the way it is currently in. he will work with congress to find offsets. romney has not named any offsets or shown how to pay for it, and it's not clear that he can, given the size of it and given his promise of not letting it become a tax cut for the rich. that's what romney did last night. every time obama said you have a $5 trillion tax cut, he said no i don't. the truth is we don't know what it is. as he's running for president, i think it's information that we're frankly entitled to. >> let me play another clip. the president criticized romney for a lack of specifics in the tax plan and wall street reform and health care. that's how that went down. >> my experience as a governor
to do to the tax code. he has a tax cut that would cost $5 trillion. that part is true. the president is right about that. romney said from the very beginning, he's consistent so nothing he said last night was new. it's important to put that clearly. he's always said he will pay for that tax cut. that tax cut will not be passed the way it is currently in. he will work with congress to find offsets. romney has not named any offsets or shown how to pay for it, and it's not clear that he can,...
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massive tax increase. romney cannot defend this plan on its merits, so he simply says i'll negotiate this with congress. it doesn't matter what he negotiates, there's not enough money there. it's a simple matter of arithmetic. but he's being a smooth liar about this. >> is the mathematics policy? can you offset $5 trillion with big deductions by getting rid of them when he said tonight to accomplicer, i'm going to leave the mortgage preference, the charitable preference, what is left? >> first off, you're kind of misquoting what he said. number one, he said it's not a $5 trillion dr. >> 4.8. >> but it is. i don't care what he says, he's lying. it is $5 trillion. >> bob, let me make mire point. >> don't repeat his lie without any evidence. >> i'm not repeating it. the fact you call it a lie, you take that up with him. >> no, he's the one who's lying. >> let me make the point. how does it not -- >> the fact of the matter is he's identified that what he's going to do is limply fill the tax code in a number of
massive tax increase. romney cannot defend this plan on its merits, so he simply says i'll negotiate this with congress. it doesn't matter what he negotiates, there's not enough money there. it's a simple matter of arithmetic. but he's being a smooth liar about this. >> is the mathematics policy? can you offset $5 trillion with big deductions by getting rid of them when he said tonight to accomplicer, i'm going to leave the mortgage preference, the charitable preference, what is left?...
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federal income, state sales tax, property tax cab gas tax, over 50% of what they earned. and your plan is to take the tax rate on successful small businesses from 35% to 40%. the national federation of independent businesses has said that will cost 700,000 jobs. >> what is main street's reaction? we have two of our most outspeaken regulars here to discuss. app entrepreneur and best-selling author, find him at rural 1 investing upon the com. carol roth, can you find her at carolroth.com. good to you you guy he. >> you too, j. >> i think it is clear that romney ran all over obama. from a small business owner's perspective he addressed the issues we have not seen addressed offer the laugh four years. most notably, how are we going to get this economy growing again because from a small business owner's perspective, that is what is going to get them hiring and make them more successful. if the economy grows, more people are buying from them. there's more confidence, and it is just a self fulfilling prophecy. >> what we are dealing with here, four years -- apart from what presi
federal income, state sales tax, property tax cab gas tax, over 50% of what they earned. and your plan is to take the tax rate on successful small businesses from 35% to 40%. the national federation of independent businesses has said that will cost 700,000 jobs. >> what is main street's reaction? we have two of our most outspeaken regulars here to discuss. app entrepreneur and best-selling author, find him at rural 1 investing upon the com. carol roth, can you find her at carolroth.com....
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this is a tax in and of itself. call it the economy tax. it's been crushing. at the same time, gasoline prices doubled. electric rates are up, food prices are up. health care costs have gone up by $2500 a family. middle income families are being crushed. the question is how to get them going again. >> governor romney defended his tax plan repeatedly. the romney proposal would give breaks to the wealthy while putting a burden on the middle class. >> i know you and your running mate keep saying that. it's popular, but it's not the case. i have five boys. i'm used to people saying something that's not always true but keep on repeating it hoping i'll believe it. that is not the case. i will not reduce the taxes paid by high income americans. number three, i will not, under any circumstances raise taxes on middle income families. >> for 18 months, he's been running on this tax plan. now, five weeks before the election, he's saying his idea is never mind. the fact is that if you are lowering the rates the way you describe, governor, then it is not possible to come u
this is a tax in and of itself. call it the economy tax. it's been crushing. at the same time, gasoline prices doubled. electric rates are up, food prices are up. health care costs have gone up by $2500 a family. middle income families are being crushed. the question is how to get them going again. >> governor romney defended his tax plan repeatedly. the romney proposal would give breaks to the wealthy while putting a burden on the middle class. >> i know you and your running mate...
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so let's hear him explain the tax policy. >> the cut in tax rates is lower -- all american tax rates -- >> how much does it cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> it's not revenue neutral unless you take away the deductions. the first half, lowering the tax rates. does that cost $5 trillion? >> no, no. look, i won't get into a baseline argument with you. >> you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go through all the math. >> all right. you know what, mitt? you better put paul ryan away somewhere. send him to a sports bar somewhere in ohio. at least he can have a few beers with voters. he's got that going for him. who knows, it might help make inroads with that 9% deficit romney is facing against the president in the latest ohio poll. then again, there may not be enough time to do enough shots with enough intoxicated fans before voting starts in ohio tomorrow. so if his running mate is no use, how about a boost from the other person mitt's proposed to, his wife, ann. surely she can provide the comfort and confidence that mr. romney needs
so let's hear him explain the tax policy. >> the cut in tax rates is lower -- all american tax rates -- >> how much does it cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> it's not revenue neutral unless you take away the deductions. the first half, lowering the tax rates. does that cost $5 trillion? >> no, no. look, i won't get into a baseline argument with you. >> you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go...
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i don't have a tax cut that's $4.8 trillion. i'm not going to cut taxes on the rich. i don't have a medicare voucher plan. i love teachers. and i think we need more of them. look, don't believe me. speaker gingrich was pretty eloquent running during the primaries and saying, mitt romney will say absolutely anything to get elected. and if somebody says absolutely anything to get elected you have to wonder what they'll say when they are president of the united states. >> so, speaker, you did say he was fundamentally dishonest after debating him in the primaries. this is not a new attack against romney policy. >> no. and i think that the challenge for the obama people is pretty simple. the president of the united states had 90 minutes. now, if he had done his homework and actually prepared, if he had actually studied romney, why didn't he say it? why didn't he take romney head on? first of all, the charges on the tax cuts are plain wrong, and i think virtually every analyst has said and even your deputy campaign manager said the charges made are wrong. but forgetting tha
i don't have a tax cut that's $4.8 trillion. i'm not going to cut taxes on the rich. i don't have a medicare voucher plan. i love teachers. and i think we need more of them. look, don't believe me. speaker gingrich was pretty eloquent running during the primaries and saying, mitt romney will say absolutely anything to get elected. and if somebody says absolutely anything to get elected you have to wonder what they'll say when they are president of the united states. >> so, speaker, you...
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be a 20% tax cut? >> i'm going to lower rates across the board for all americans by 20%. i want a 20% across the board reduction in taxes. the individual marginal tax rate 20% across the board. the top rate, for instance, would go from 35 to 28, middle rates would come down by 20% as well, all rates come down. >> president obama was just as surprised. >> well, for 18 months he's been running on this tax plan. and now, five weeks before the election, he's saying that his big, bold idea is never mind. >> but the etch a sketching did not stop there. governor romney who once believed financial regulation was hurting the economy -- >> dodd frank it's called, has not helped enterprise get going, it's slowed it down. >> now seems to be a supporter of wall street regulation. >> want to repeal dodd/frank? >> and replace it. we're not going to get rid of regulation. some parts of dodd/frank that make all of the sense in the world. >> and back in june, romney mocked the president's crazy ideas about needing more
be a 20% tax cut? >> i'm going to lower rates across the board for all americans by 20%. i want a 20% across the board reduction in taxes. the individual marginal tax rate 20% across the board. the top rate, for instance, would go from 35 to 28, middle rates would come down by 20% as well, all rates come down. >> president obama was just as surprised. >> well, for 18 months he's been running on this tax plan. and now, five weeks before the election, he's saying that his big,...
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overall taxes that they pay and the overall tax plan would be tax neutral. i mean, it would be revenue neutral. the other piece is you mentioned this other story -- >> the story is specifics, hasn't it? >> i'll keep going back to this to seep the record straight. you all talking about this story that mitt romney had been saying and reported in other places that this is a new softer side of mitt romney. he's been telling that story for months. and so, i mean, this is all just sort of a generated media narrative that he is coming up with all sorts of new policies and new touching stories. this is, you know, what's great about last week is it's our opportunity to present an unfiltered mitt romney versus an unfiltered barack obama and the choice was houistorically. >> let's ask you then about specifically what the panelist talked about, the thing that a lot of analysts are watching is are the polls going to move in the swing states? it is early to tell. the jobs numbers may factor in to this. can mitt romney move the polls in a place like ohio? where before the
overall taxes that they pay and the overall tax plan would be tax neutral. i mean, it would be revenue neutral. the other piece is you mentioned this other story -- >> the story is specifics, hasn't it? >> i'll keep going back to this to seep the record straight. you all talking about this story that mitt romney had been saying and reported in other places that this is a new softer side of mitt romney. he's been telling that story for months. and so, i mean, this is all just sort of...
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i'm not in favor of a $5 trillion tax cut. >> analysis from the nonpartisan tax policy center found romney's plan would cost the country $5 trillion over the the next ten years. romney's friends at fox news say romney doesn't have to explain his fuzzy math. here's chris wallace defending romney's flip-flop to governor martin o'malley. >> the president keeps saying that mitt romney is proposing a $5 trillion tax cut. that's not true. >> chris, wait a minute here. former governor is proposing a cut to income taxes including for the wealthiest of americans and i believe a 30% cut to corporate income taxes. >> any economist may debate whether that adds up to $4.9 trillion or $5 trillion. >> you're mischaracterizing the romney plan. you're saying, you're right, $5 trillion by lowering the tax rates, but he also talks about cutting loopholes. that's part of the plan. >> he won't say which loopholes and which deduction. >> joining me is e.j. dionne, author of the new book "our divided political heart." i've got so much heart. you know the details, the devil in the details, however, you want to say
i'm not in favor of a $5 trillion tax cut. >> analysis from the nonpartisan tax policy center found romney's plan would cost the country $5 trillion over the the next ten years. romney's friends at fox news say romney doesn't have to explain his fuzzy math. here's chris wallace defending romney's flip-flop to governor martin o'malley. >> the president keeps saying that mitt romney is proposing a $5 trillion tax cut. that's not true. >> chris, wait a minute here. former...
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then he can't deliver tax cuts. >> you can come up with a tax reform plan. increased revenue that takes down the rates, makes it fairer everybody. it's difficult, but you can do it. >> you can't take the rates down 20% though on top of the bush tax cuts. >> romney said, i have reform principles. they are going to help grow the economy and create jobs but the idea he can raise taxes is fanciful. he'll never do it. >> if you are going to cut taxes for the wealthy as much as mitt romney wants to there is no way or he would have put forth the pro growth plan. he's ring on magic like harry potter will be his treasury secretary. >> he's not going to be able to cut taxes for rich people. he doesn't want to. the idea of pro growth taxes -- >> didn't he say 20% across the board? >> he did, but he also said if you take up the deductions, rich people won't get a big tax break. that's the truth. if you go through the principles and think about it, how do you design a pro growth tax policy? you have to take down the race and get rid of deductions. the numbers can add up.
then he can't deliver tax cuts. >> you can come up with a tax reform plan. increased revenue that takes down the rates, makes it fairer everybody. it's difficult, but you can do it. >> you can't take the rates down 20% though on top of the bush tax cuts. >> romney said, i have reform principles. they are going to help grow the economy and create jobs but the idea he can raise taxes is fanciful. he'll never do it. >> if you are going to cut taxes for the wealthy as much...
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check this out. >> by kiting taxes, with the big tax cut? >> those are yours, not mine. >> thank you very much, sir. >> that was kind of strange. >> yeah, take off that microphone. good luck trying that with joe biden on thursday. >>> plus big bird is still flying high, and there are signs now that the great yellow friend is getting under mitt romney's skin. >>> and the inside story of the family intervention inside the romney campaign. it's a real shocker, and it really happened. you're watches "politics nation" on msnbc. [ male announcer ] how do you make america's favorite recipes? just begin with america's favorite soups. bring out chicken broccoli alfredo. or best-ever meatloaf. go to campbellskitchen.com for recipes, plus a valuable coupon. campbell's. it's amazing what soup can do. you can mix and match all day! [ male announcer ] don't miss red lobster's endless shrimp, just $14.99! try as much as you like, any way you like! like parmesan crusted shrimp. hurry in, offer ends soon! i'm ryan isabell and i see food differently. >>> have
check this out. >> by kiting taxes, with the big tax cut? >> those are yours, not mine. >> thank you very much, sir. >> that was kind of strange. >> yeah, take off that microphone. good luck trying that with joe biden on thursday. >>> plus big bird is still flying high, and there are signs now that the great yellow friend is getting under mitt romney's skin. >>> and the inside story of the family intervention inside the romney campaign. it's a...
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we'll get to the deductions but the cut in tax rates. >> the cut in tax rates is lower all americans tax rates by 20%. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue lowering. you can -- >> i have to -- you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go through all of the math. >> yesterday mitt romney finally gave in, sort of. he didn't detail the deductions he intends to eliminate, but at least offered a few suggestions. >> you could say everybody is going to get up to a $17,000 deduction and use your charitable deduction or your home mortgage deduction or others, health care deduction and fill that bucket, the $17,000 bucket that way and higher income people might have a lower number or do it by the same method that bowles-simpson did it, limiting certain deductions, that's the sort of thing you do with congress. >> so there you go. that's the sort of thing he's talking about. romney's campaign emphasized after the interview those ideas are actually not part of his plan writing -- mark halperin, as you know, i'm an easily confused person
we'll get to the deductions but the cut in tax rates. >> the cut in tax rates is lower all americans tax rates by 20%. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue lowering. you can -- >> i have to -- you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go through all of the math. >> yesterday mitt romney finally gave in, sort of. he didn't detail the deductions he intends to eliminate, but at least offered a few...
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romney's tax plan. for months he's been telling us that he'll cut everyone's taxes by 20%. so some of the country's brightest economists did the math and found that romney's tax plan promises to cut taxes by $5 trillion without adding to the deficit. but when mitt romney took to the stage last night, he delivered a line that beggared belief. >> no economist can say mitt romney's tax plan adds $5 trillion if i say i will not add to the deficit with my tax plan. >> so black is white, up is down, and everything is the way he says it is in the world of mitt romney. like yago, mitt romney delivered those lines in the presence of a black man, but on this occasion the president would not be deceived. he allowed mr. romney to rehearse the full extent of his lie and then just a few hours ago drew our attention to what really happened last night. >> the real mitt romney has been running around the country for the last year promising $5 trillion in tax cuts in favor of the wealthy. the fellow on stage last night said he didn't know anything about that. >> mr. romney is quite rightly b
romney's tax plan. for months he's been telling us that he'll cut everyone's taxes by 20%. so some of the country's brightest economists did the math and found that romney's tax plan promises to cut taxes by $5 trillion without adding to the deficit. but when mitt romney took to the stage last night, he delivered a line that beggared belief. >> no economist can say mitt romney's tax plan adds $5 trillion if i say i will not add to the deficit with my tax plan. >> so black is white,...
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. >> at the debate he said he's not going to cut taxes for the wealthy. in the primary he said he's going to cut taxes for everyone. >> i'm going to lower rates across the board for all americans. isn't that a change? >> let me repeat what i said. >> lying, denying and alibiing. >> is that leadership? >> we can't debate the debate. >> the war continues. >> let's move on. >> we are awaiting a major foreign policy address. >> romney boiled down the president's foreign policy to one of hope. >> hope is not a strategy. >> but on actual foreign policy romney's specifics were rather thin. >> i'll support the libyan's people efforts to support a lasting government. >> how about iran? >> prevent them from acquiring nuclear weapons capability. >> that's the same. >> this is the same guy who couldn't even go to the olympics. >> he will say anything, he will do anything. >> his mention of russia. >> without question of number one geo political foe. >> there are two kinds of success, initial and ultimate. >> i still believe you in and i hope you still believe in me.
. >> at the debate he said he's not going to cut taxes for the wealthy. in the primary he said he's going to cut taxes for everyone. >> i'm going to lower rates across the board for all americans. isn't that a change? >> let me repeat what i said. >> lying, denying and alibiing. >> is that leadership? >> we can't debate the debate. >> the war continues. >> let's move on. >> we are awaiting a major foreign policy address. >> romney...
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he wants to cut personal income taxes by 20%, corporate taxes from 35% to 25%, extend the bush tax cuts and the alternative minimum tax. that's $5 trillion, whether he likes it or not, or whether he wants to admit it or not. and he says he's going to do that all without adding to the deficits. how? he didn't say last night. and that's why most analysts have said he's either going to explode the deficits or stick it to the middle class. on medicare, he said we're not going to hurt one senior on medicare by repealing obamacare. he's going to raise -- he's going to cut benefits for seniors across america. he wasn't honest about that. you guys have the tape of him saying we don't need anymore teachers. last night he couldn't say enough about teachers. i don't want to cut teachers. i want more teachers. that's not what he said. so, i mean, again and again and again, he told a story to the american people that is completely in contrast with what he said before and unfounded in fact. and that's going to catch up with him. i think that i give him credit for a strong performance. i give him an "
he wants to cut personal income taxes by 20%, corporate taxes from 35% to 25%, extend the bush tax cuts and the alternative minimum tax. that's $5 trillion, whether he likes it or not, or whether he wants to admit it or not. and he says he's going to do that all without adding to the deficits. how? he didn't say last night. and that's why most analysts have said he's either going to explode the deficits or stick it to the middle class. on medicare, he said we're not going to hurt one senior on...
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that's not a tax raise. that's called fairness where i come from. >> and last night on "politics nation," jared bernstein explained to al sharpton that the math in mitt romney's tax plan doesn't add up. >> if you're going to cut taxes 20% across the board, which is mitt romney's plan, you're going to blow a $5 trillion hole over ten years in the government's revenue. now, what governor romney says is i can make that up by closing tax expenditures and loopholes, but there's two problems with that. one, the arithmetic. if you look at people over 200,000, just look at the wealthiest couple of percent, the revenue cuts about $250 billion, and the deductions, the broadening of the base, gets you back about 160. so you're short about $90 billion. >> and don't miss reverend al sharpton and "politics nation" weekdays at 6:00 eastern here on msnbc, the place for politics. >>> so how will today's monthly jobs report impact the candidates? economists are predicting the unemployment rate could tick up from 8.1 to 8.2%,
that's not a tax raise. that's called fairness where i come from. >> and last night on "politics nation," jared bernstein explained to al sharpton that the math in mitt romney's tax plan doesn't add up. >> if you're going to cut taxes 20% across the board, which is mitt romney's plan, you're going to blow a $5 trillion hole over ten years in the government's revenue. now, what governor romney says is i can make that up by closing tax expenditures and loopholes, but there's...
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>> keeping tax rates down. by lowering tax rates, people keep more of the dollar they earn. that matters. that is pro-growth policy. that creates seven million jobs. >> that's more important than? >> than anything. >> tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires are more important than anything else? those are paul ryan's words. for bet about paying for the tax cuts that he's talking about. you know, they are here to stay if romney and ryan get elected. you can count on that. it's no wonder the romney campaign is struggling with this entire message. but when all else fails, what you got to do is blame the media. >> carrying water for barack obama? >> it kind of goes without saying that there's definitely a media bias. >> where have you seen it in this campaign where you feel they are judging you by one standard and obama by another? >> i'm not going into fit for tat. there's a media bias. and anybody with objectivity would believe that. >> blaming the media is the latest talking point for paul ryan. at a fundraiser, ryan told supporters the campaign needs their help to fight
>> keeping tax rates down. by lowering tax rates, people keep more of the dollar they earn. that matters. that is pro-growth policy. that creates seven million jobs. >> that's more important than? >> than anything. >> tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires are more important than anything else? those are paul ryan's words. for bet about paying for the tax cuts that he's talking about. you know, they are here to stay if romney and ryan get elected. you can count on...
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tax rates. it's revenue neutral. >> it's not unless you take away the deductions. we're going to get to that. the first half. lowering the tax rates. does that cost $5 trillion? >> no. >> the master of the power point was having a hard time making a point. let's break down what paul ryan is actually saying here. romney and ryan will give trillion in tax breaks to the wealthiest americans. subtract an unspecified amount of money of unnamed deductions. somehow you're going to get a revenue neutral tax plan. it's a plan so bogus not even a fox news host can understand it. >> you haven't given me the math. >> i don't have the -- it would take me too long to go through the math. >> paul ryan, paul ryan, if you want to be a heartbeat away from the presidency, we're going to have to explain your plans to the american people. take all the time you want. especially here on "the ed show." you guys have been complaining about media fairness preponderance let's talk it over. today paul ryan told a radio hos
tax rates. it's revenue neutral. >> it's not unless you take away the deductions. we're going to get to that. the first half. lowering the tax rates. does that cost $5 trillion? >> no. >> the master of the power point was having a hard time making a point. let's break down what paul ryan is actually saying here. romney and ryan will give trillion in tax breaks to the wealthiest americans. subtract an unspecified amount of money of unnamed deductions. somehow you're going to...
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. >> first of all, i don't have a $5 trillion tax cut. i'm not looking for a $5 trillion tax cut. let me repeat what i said, i'm not in favor after $5 trillion tax cut. that's not my plan. >> a romney's plan could cost the country $5 trillion over the next five years. his friends at fox news says he doesn't have to explain his fuzzy math. here is chris wallace depending romney's flip-flop to o'malley. >> the president says that mitt romney is proposing a $5 trillion tax cut. that's not true. >> kras, wait a minute here. the governor -- i mean, former governor romney, is proposing 0% cut to income taxes, including for the wealthiest of americans and 30% cut to corporate income taxes. any economist my debate whether that is 4.9 trillion or 5 trillion. >> you're mischaracterizing the romney plan. you're right, 5 trillion by lowering the tax rates but also cuts about cutting loop holes and -- >> ahhhh. >> but that is part of the plan. >> but he won't say which loop holes and which deductions. >> joining me washington post kol columnest and author. you. >> you have a lot of heart, ed.
. >> first of all, i don't have a $5 trillion tax cut. i'm not looking for a $5 trillion tax cut. let me repeat what i said, i'm not in favor after $5 trillion tax cut. that's not my plan. >> a romney's plan could cost the country $5 trillion over the next five years. his friends at fox news says he doesn't have to explain his fuzzy math. here is chris wallace depending romney's flip-flop to o'malley. >> the president says that mitt romney is proposing a $5 trillion tax cut....
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minimum tax. when you do that over ten years you put $5 trillion hole in your revenue. so that's where obama gets $5 trillion tax cut. but governor romney says he will make up that money through eliminating loopholes, tax deductions that sort of thing but he hasn't specifically said which one his would target. but that's how he can say, i don't have a $5 trillion tax cut. obama can come back and say you haven't given specifics how can we believe it really adds up. in fact every study nonpartisan that has looked at this has said that you know, unless you really tweaked the numbers, there's not justify money out there to fill that $5 trillion hole. >> so, glenn, the president said she's the guy plan to cut $4 trillion in the deficit. here's how he describes that plan. >> the way we do it is $2.50 for every cut, we ask for a dollar of additional revenue. governor romney earlier mentioned the bowles-simpson commission. well that's how the commission bipartisan commission, that talked about how we shou
minimum tax. when you do that over ten years you put $5 trillion hole in your revenue. so that's where obama gets $5 trillion tax cut. but governor romney says he will make up that money through eliminating loopholes, tax deductions that sort of thing but he hasn't specifically said which one his would target. but that's how he can say, i don't have a $5 trillion tax cut. obama can come back and say you haven't given specifics how can we believe it really adds up. in fact every study...
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the fact these bums don't want to pay tax and the richest guy in the world is avoiding tax. >> bill clinton has the best peripheral vision in the history of politics. he knows how to do it. clinton uses a sense of humor to do it, to make the other guy seem like a complete hypocritical phoney. rather than say the guy is a hypocritical phoney, bill clinton builds the occasion like he's talking to the jury. that's what he did there. that's the obstacle that mitt romney has. the way people view mitt romney, in the nbc poll, they still basically have a negative view of the guy. he has to come out there and say, i know how to fix the economy on your behalf, even though people know his whole life has been dedicated to flipping corporates and doing the magic that he did that got him the caymen offshore account. and $100 million i.r.a., individual retirement account. >> he has to show -- >> how does a guy -- >> how does that help us? >> -- have a $100 million individual retirement account? >> one thing president clinton has done so successfully, he's not against wealth. he's just against hypocrisy,
the fact these bums don't want to pay tax and the richest guy in the world is avoiding tax. >> bill clinton has the best peripheral vision in the history of politics. he knows how to do it. clinton uses a sense of humor to do it, to make the other guy seem like a complete hypocritical phoney. rather than say the guy is a hypocritical phoney, bill clinton builds the occasion like he's talking to the jury. that's what he did there. that's the obstacle that mitt romney has. the way people...
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he would repeal the alternative minimum tax and the estate tax. the snon-partisan tax said it would cost $4.8 trillion over ten years. romney said his plan would be paid for. to pay for the cuts, he would have to close loopholes in the tax codes and get red of deductions and credits. he hasn't said which he'd get rid of, saying he would work with congress. president obama said his plan would cut the deficit by $4 trillion. >> we all know we have to do more. so, i put forward a specific $4 trillion deficit reduction plan. it's on a website. you can look at all the numbers, what cuts we make and what revenue we raise. >> that comes from the budget and policy priorities. the president is counting money saved by letting the bush tax cuts expire for people making more than $250,000 a year. he's counting $1 trillion in savings but cutting down the wars in iraq and afghanistan. the committee for responsible budget called that a gimmick. they were deficit financed in the first place. the president is counting on savings from last year when the white house
he would repeal the alternative minimum tax and the estate tax. the snon-partisan tax said it would cost $4.8 trillion over ten years. romney said his plan would be paid for. to pay for the cuts, he would have to close loopholes in the tax codes and get red of deductions and credits. he hasn't said which he'd get rid of, saying he would work with congress. president obama said his plan would cut the deficit by $4 trillion. >> we all know we have to do more. so, i put forward a specific $4...
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but the cut in tax rates. >> the cut in tax rates is lower -- all american tax rates by 20%. >> how much does it cost? >> it's revenue neutral. it works and you can -- >> but i have to -- you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the -- it would take me too long to go through all of the math. >> you know, tonight, jim lehrer, he's a great moderator. take all of the time you want. take my time to explain how you're going to do it. yesterday romney himself told a local denver station that part of his tax plan might include a cap on deductions at 17,000 a person which would not hurt billionaires at all like him. let's take a look. >> you could say everybody's going to get up to $17,000 deduction and you can use your charitable deduction, your home mortgage deduction or others, health care deduction and you can fill that bucket, if you will, the $17,000 bucket and higher income might have a lower number or you could do it by the same method that bowles/simpson did it, which is limiting certain deductions but that's the sort of thing that -- >> well, his tighing would take him past
but the cut in tax rates. >> the cut in tax rates is lower -- all american tax rates by 20%. >> how much does it cost? >> it's revenue neutral. it works and you can -- >> but i have to -- you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the -- it would take me too long to go through all of the math. >> you know, tonight, jim lehrer, he's a great moderator. take all of the time you want. take my time to explain how you're going to do it. yesterday romney...
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i will lower taxes on middle income families. >> he's going to get rid of the estate tax, mr. mayor, which aims directly at the top rate. the people who have a quarter million bucks and want to leave it to their kids. it's nor the very rich. he wants to lower the top rate from 35% to 28% for the richest people in the country. he wants to take the corp rate rate from 35% to 25%. >> clearly at that stage mr. obama should have turned to him and said you are not telling the american people the truth. just as he did today in denver when he said he wasn't telling the truth. he should have looked him in the eye and said mitt romney, you are not telling the american people the truth. and then proceed to walk through as clinton would have done the mathematics to prove it. i don't think romney would have been smart enough to figure out how to get out of that hit, but obama ignored that opportunity and i think that's a mistake. joan, you're correct. he will everywhere he goes, he will save the day and correct what he didn't do last night, but 58 million people will not be able to be cont
i will lower taxes on middle income families. >> he's going to get rid of the estate tax, mr. mayor, which aims directly at the top rate. the people who have a quarter million bucks and want to leave it to their kids. it's nor the very rich. he wants to lower the top rate from 35% to 28% for the richest people in the country. he wants to take the corp rate rate from 35% to 25%. >> clearly at that stage mr. obama should have turned to him and said you are not telling the american...
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there's a 20% rate reduction from the bush tax cuts, we're going to end the estate tax. we're going to cut the corporate tax rate from 35% to 25%. you cannot sit here, mr. speaker or anybody can sit here and say that doesn't require a reduction in the amount of revenue by $4.8 trillion. >> i'll say it i'll say it. >> moderates, levels, everybody says here's the problem, you guys won't give them any credit for closing loopholes. he won't name the loopholes, you're attacking him for not giving you the target and you tack him when you get the target. >> and it's like admitting that the substance doesn't match up. >> if there's substance, why do, you keep bringing up substance. let me hear some obama substance. your substance is always to attack romney. >> if he had a couple of sharp ideas and looked like he liked the job, he would have had a much better debate. >> mitt romney said my health care plan will do the same thing. >> it doesn't seem to me that it's as binary as this, mr. speaker. think there's an issue of whether something has to give. can you talk about fact chec
there's a 20% rate reduction from the bush tax cuts, we're going to end the estate tax. we're going to cut the corporate tax rate from 35% to 25%. you cannot sit here, mr. speaker or anybody can sit here and say that doesn't require a reduction in the amount of revenue by $4.8 trillion. >> i'll say it i'll say it. >> moderates, levels, everybody says here's the problem, you guys won't give them any credit for closing loopholes. he won't name the loopholes, you're attacking him for...
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president, you are right with regards to 97% of the businesses are not taxed at 35% tax rate, it's a lower rate. those businesses, the last 3% happen to employ half, half of all the people who work in small business. >> okay. please respond to that. there is so much nonsense in that little bit of sound. >> first of all, the statistic that it employs half is ridiculous. let's look at it carefully. under that definition of small business, i'm a business. why? because i have written a book. i get royalties. that's business income. mitt romney cuts my taxes. now, i'm not going to hire anyone. this idea that cutting the taxes is going to lead to job growth is absurd. in contrast, the president saying i'm for tax cuts but i am if you actually hire someone. >> my brain was soup as i was trying to sort through all these definitions. the sba, small business administration is trying to define it as a business with 500 people or less. it's not the definition being used here. the definition here is a tax status. in this study. >> this is where the fact is wrong. >> yes. thank you. >> all people
president, you are right with regards to 97% of the businesses are not taxed at 35% tax rate, it's a lower rate. those businesses, the last 3% happen to employ half, half of all the people who work in small business. >> okay. please respond to that. there is so much nonsense in that little bit of sound. >> first of all, the statistic that it employs half is ridiculous. let's look at it carefully. under that definition of small business, i'm a business. why? because i have written a...
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taxes and cut everyone's income tax by 20%. the math doesn't seem to add up there. the other striking thing being he picked paul ryan, the man known for putting out -- at least more details than mitt romney, but he has not embraced. ryanism to me, at least, the core is we're going to be detailed about what conservative policy means. romney's not embraced that at all. >> good luck tonight. thank you both. new next, tick tock, tick tock. let's clear the air from a mile up. look, if you have copd like me, you know it can be hard to breathe, and how that feels. copd includes chronic bronchitis and emphysema. spiriva helps control my copd symptoms by keeping my airways open for 24 hours. plus, it reduces copd flare-ups. spiriva is the only once-daily inhaled copd maintenance treatment that does both. spiriva handihaler tiotropium bromide inhalation powder does not replace fast-acting inhalers for sudden symptoms. tell your doctor if you have kidney problems, glaucoma, trouble urinating, or an enlarged prostate. these may worsen with
taxes and cut everyone's income tax by 20%. the math doesn't seem to add up there. the other striking thing being he picked paul ryan, the man known for putting out -- at least more details than mitt romney, but he has not embraced. ryanism to me, at least, the core is we're going to be detailed about what conservative policy means. romney's not embraced that at all. >> good luck tonight. thank you both. new next, tick tock, tick tock. let's clear the air from a mile up. look, if you have...
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as it relates to his tax plan, he has said very clearly that, a, he wants to cut certain tax loopholes, b, he wants to keep the bush era tax cut rates in place, and c, we need to make sure we can work with congress in a bipartisan fashion to get it done. i think that's very fair, i think it's a question that will be asked of him tomorrow by jim lehrer. >> it's also been deemed as mathematically impossible. thank you. as the candidates gear up, we are headed to denver. we will broadcast live from the university of denver, so be sure to tune in tomorrow, 4:00 p.m. eastern. >>> next, the 47 and bain. sure to take center stage tomorrow. stay with us. >> you haven't given me the math. >> but, well, i don't have the time -- it would take me too lock to go through all the math. >> great answer. why? it's a great answer. why is it a great answer? well, it would take me too long to explain, but trust me, it was a great answer. [ man ] ring ring... progresso this reduced sodium soup says it may help lower cholesterol, how does it work? you just have to eat it as part of your heart healthy diet.
as it relates to his tax plan, he has said very clearly that, a, he wants to cut certain tax loopholes, b, he wants to keep the bush era tax cut rates in place, and c, we need to make sure we can work with congress in a bipartisan fashion to get it done. i think that's very fair, i think it's a question that will be asked of him tomorrow by jim lehrer. >> it's also been deemed as mathematically impossible. thank you. as the candidates gear up, we are headed to denver. we will broadcast...
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the tax plan still doesn't add up. the question for him is whether or not he's able to obscure o that on the stage tonight. >> ezra. thank you. so chris hayes, do we end up in a mega-audience version of paul ryan saying this weekend, i don't really have the time to give you the numbers. i'd bore you if i gave you the math. >> that, to me, is the most fascinating element in this debate. is that he has said time and time again, mitt romney even said at one point, look, i learned from governor christie, if you give people details, they just use it to attack you. he has said explicitly as a matter of strategy, we won't give you more details. so how long can he avoid details on stage with the president for 90 minutes. and the other problem, it's not just bain, it's not just fact that this is the wealthiest man to run for president, well, in nominal dollars, ever, but in real dollars, in a long time. but he is proposing the same thing that republicans always propose when they get into office. the one reliable policy you can
the tax plan still doesn't add up. the question for him is whether or not he's able to obscure o that on the stage tonight. >> ezra. thank you. so chris hayes, do we end up in a mega-audience version of paul ryan saying this weekend, i don't really have the time to give you the numbers. i'd bore you if i gave you the math. >> that, to me, is the most fascinating element in this debate. is that he has said time and time again, mitt romney even said at one point, look, i learned from...
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asked if woe release more taxes. there needs to be some kind of tax question tonight because the reality is that a lot of folks don't earn very much money in places here like denver are paying a higher percentage of their income than romney. romney believes there should be lower rates for investments but hasn't explained why it is fair that he pays a lower rate. >> quick on your list of questions, many have been asked to the candidates at some point or certainly, prepared to answer. will you be stunned if the questions on the stimulus on the case of the president or taxes, to romney, go unanswered without the candidate being specific? >> well, i won't be surprised at all but the nice thing about a debate is that i think the moderator, jim lehrer, is going to take a step back and allow the clash between the candidates. i think if romney gives a nonanswer to that question we just talked about obama will say, no, answer that question and that will generate an exciting back and forth and make for a great debate. sfeefrnl
asked if woe release more taxes. there needs to be some kind of tax question tonight because the reality is that a lot of folks don't earn very much money in places here like denver are paying a higher percentage of their income than romney. romney believes there should be lower rates for investments but hasn't explained why it is fair that he pays a lower rate. >> quick on your list of questions, many have been asked to the candidates at some point or certainly, prepared to answer. will...
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first is the tax reform. fundamental tax reform across the board which is going to help americans put more money in their pockets for those middle class americans that do a lot of the spending in this country and i think they need it the most. >> will governor romney explain? >> on issues like health care, those are also issues that the governor will address comprehensively and talk about the specifics of how it would help households keep more money and going to help grow the entire economy. >> kevin, excuse me, sorry, didn't mean to interrupt you. >> no worries, sorry. >> will governor romney tomorrow night in denver explain exactly which deductions he would get rid of to make up for the tax cuts that he's offered? >> well, i think it's very hard in a debate to go through a negotiation, particularly when you look at broadening the tax base you're going to have to do it with congress. it's hard to get into those details. he will talk about the fundamental principles that he has with regards to tax form, helpi
first is the tax reform. fundamental tax reform across the board which is going to help americans put more money in their pockets for those middle class americans that do a lot of the spending in this country and i think they need it the most. >> will governor romney explain? >> on issues like health care, those are also issues that the governor will address comprehensively and talk about the specifics of how it would help households keep more money and going to help grow the entire...
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the cut in tax rates. >> lowers all americans tax rates. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> it's not revenue neutral unless it takes away -- >> lowering tax rates by broadening the tax base -- >> you haven't given me the math? >> it would take me too long to go through all the math. >>> in massachusetts tonight, senator scott brown and his democratic challenge elizabeth warren face off in the second of four debates for that u.s. senate seat up there. david gregory will moderate it comes as new boston globe poll shows warren inching slightly ahead, 43% to 38%. still 18% of voters remain undecided there. the same poll conducted in may gave senator brown a two-point lead. >>> still ahead on "way too early," wow were the new york jets bad yesterday. shutout, blownout, injured on their home field. rex ryan's press game post conference the only highlight of the day. >>> and an incredible comeback by team europe at ryder cup. the united states entered sunday with a big lead and it's big guns on the course. we'll show you what happened in sports. all that
the cut in tax rates. >> lowers all americans tax rates. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> it's not revenue neutral unless it takes away -- >> lowering tax rates by broadening the tax base -- >> you haven't given me the math? >> it would take me too long to go through all the math. >>> in massachusetts tonight, senator scott brown and his democratic challenge elizabeth warren face off in the second of four debates for that...
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i don't have a tax cut that's $4.8 trillion or $5 trillion. i'm not going to cut taxes on the rich. i don't have a medicare voucher plan. i love teachers, i think we need more of them. i mean, look, don't believe me, speaker gingrich was pretty eloquent in running during the primaries in saying, look, mitt romney will say absolutely anything to get elected. >> well, one thing i have been saying about the campaign is the president needs surrogates out there, he needs confederates, people out there. i love charleston. a lot of people -- rather charlotte because in charlotte you heard an entire political party speaking led by people like deval patrick, the governor of massachusetts, after you saw mr. mayor. i think it sounds better when it's a serenade than when it's a solo. what do you think about that? because the other guy has these terrible attack dogs out there, people like trump pitching the birtherism nonsense, sununu talking about being lazy. you got priebus and his nonsense about him being from europe and foreign and newt saying terrible things not to mention jack welch trying
i don't have a tax cut that's $4.8 trillion or $5 trillion. i'm not going to cut taxes on the rich. i don't have a medicare voucher plan. i love teachers, i think we need more of them. i mean, look, don't believe me, speaker gingrich was pretty eloquent in running during the primaries in saying, look, mitt romney will say absolutely anything to get elected. >> well, one thing i have been saying about the campaign is the president needs surrogates out there, he needs confederates, people...
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they were called somebody else's tax cuts probably less likely to be raised. >> some other body's tax cuts. we'll examine how romney may have found his inner "w" ahead on now. [ male announcer ] when these come together, and these come together, one thing you can depend on is that these will come together. delicious and wholesome. some combinations were just meant to be. tomato soup from campbell's. it's amazing what soup can do. [ male announcer ] you start your day... love you, too. ...thinking about what's important to you -- your family... ...the mortgage... the kids' college tuition. [ cellphone ringing ] but life insurance? [ horn honking ] life is unpredictable. that's why at fidelity life we want you to think about term life insurance -- taking care of your family's future expenses if something happens to you. it's easy. we get to know you and your needs, then give you our best quote and our competitors'. you choose and save up to 70%. that could mean $250,000 of coverage for just $15 a month. we offer plans with no medical exam, and we've been in business for over 100 years.
they were called somebody else's tax cuts probably less likely to be raised. >> some other body's tax cuts. we'll examine how romney may have found his inner "w" ahead on now. [ male announcer ] when these come together, and these come together, one thing you can depend on is that these will come together. delicious and wholesome. some combinations were just meant to be. tomato soup from campbell's. it's amazing what soup can do. [ male announcer ] you start your day... love...
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we just have to wean them off because they don't want to pay income tax. now, a guy with a tax account in the cayman islands is attacking other people? when you really bust someone for what you did, it really takes a lot of gal, you know. >> now, that's former president clinton. will the president go after mitt romney tonight? do you think? >> well, it's hard to imagine that somebody, either jim lehrer or the president himself, won't bring up the 47% video because it has been devastating to romney. obama has used it in ads and it plays into the perception of romney as a very rich guy who is completely out of touch with ordinary voters. however, i can't imagine that romney hasn't are practiced responses to that. he's already had an ad where he sits down, faces the camera, he tries to assure voters that he wants to help 100% of americans, everybody. but the danger for romney is seeming fake or false when he tries to connect. he has, no doubt, practiced a lot, rehearsed a lot. he has a lot of answers already planned but can he seem genuine when he's given tha
we just have to wean them off because they don't want to pay income tax. now, a guy with a tax account in the cayman islands is attacking other people? when you really bust someone for what you did, it really takes a lot of gal, you know. >> now, that's former president clinton. will the president go after mitt romney tonight? do you think? >> well, it's hard to imagine that somebody, either jim lehrer or the president himself, won't bring up the 47% video because it has been...
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and he's just as hapless on taxes. >> raise taxes with obama care but he's got another taxes in mind. >> governor romney doesn't need zingers. he needs to get his story straight. he needs to stop debating himself. and at the end of the day, this election isn't about one liners. just ask our president. >> i know folks in the media are speculating already on who's going to have the best zingers. what i'm most concerned about is having a serious discussion about what we need to do to keep the country growing and restore security for hardworking americans. that's what people are going to be listening for. that's the debate that you deserve. >> that's the debate voters deserve. and on wednesday night, they won't be distracted by any zingers cooked up by romney's team of joke writers. joining me now is michelle cottle, washington correspondent for "newsweek" and the daily beast. and dana milbank, columnist for "the washington post." thanks to you both for coming on tonight. dana, are zingers the answer for mitt romney? >> well, he has to beware the very perilous boomerang zinger. delivering
and he's just as hapless on taxes. >> raise taxes with obama care but he's got another taxes in mind. >> governor romney doesn't need zingers. he needs to get his story straight. he needs to stop debating himself. and at the end of the day, this election isn't about one liners. just ask our president. >> i know folks in the media are speculating already on who's going to have the best zingers. what i'm most concerned about is having a serious discussion about what we need to...
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i'm a former federal tax lawyer and a business owner. i get how jobs are created but i also understand how they're destroyed. >> joining me now is her competitor, jim graves, the democratic nominee for minnesota's sixth congressional district. jim, thank you for joining me. >> thank you for having me on. appreciate it. >> you had no political experience, jim, until you began your campaign. i'm sure your constituents want to hear what makes you qualified to serve in congress? >> i'm a business guy. i've created a lot of jobs. i understand the economy, budgets, how to get things done. obviously michele bachmann doesn't. so i'm prepared to go to congress and get things done, bring people together, make this economy work again and she doesn't. >> you just heard the congresswoman, though. how does your plan for the economy differentiate from hers? >> first and foremost we're not going to lower the minimum wage. that doesn't help anybody. what we need is good wage jobs. she's pledged to go to norquist and coke brothers. i'm pledging myself to
i'm a former federal tax lawyer and a business owner. i get how jobs are created but i also understand how they're destroyed. >> joining me now is her competitor, jim graves, the democratic nominee for minnesota's sixth congressional district. jim, thank you for joining me. >> thank you for having me on. appreciate it. >> you had no political experience, jim, until you began your campaign. i'm sure your constituents want to hear what makes you qualified to serve in congress?...
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raising taxes on the middle class and raising taxes on seniors. the same economists who mitt romney referred to to back up his plan said you couldn't pay for it without eliminating the mortgage introduction which many middle class families rely on if they have more specifics, we are interested to hear those tomorrow night. so far we haven't heard how you pay for it without raising taxes on the middle class. >> as we look at a new quinnipiac poll, it's finding more of the majority of americans think the president will win the debates. the president has done his best to temper debate expectations looming out there, saying he's just an okay debater. is your campaign worried these high expectations could backfire on the president? >> the president will come into the debates prepared. mitt romney has been preparing for the debates earlier than any candidate we could find on record since july. it took the week of the convention to prepare for the debates. according to "the new york times," he spent eight days preparing for this debate. we expect him to
raising taxes on the middle class and raising taxes on seniors. the same economists who mitt romney referred to to back up his plan said you couldn't pay for it without eliminating the mortgage introduction which many middle class families rely on if they have more specifics, we are interested to hear those tomorrow night. so far we haven't heard how you pay for it without raising taxes on the middle class. >> as we look at a new quinnipiac poll, it's finding more of the majority of...
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we cannot afford another round of tax cuts for the wealthy. we can't afford to gut our investments in education or clean energy or research and technology. we can't afford to roll back regulations on wall street banks or oil companies or insurance companies. that is not a jobs plan. it's not a plan to grow our economy. it's sure not a plan to strengthen our middle class. we have been there, we have tried that. we're not going back, we are moving forward. we have got a different view about how we create jobs and prosperity in this country. this country doesn't just succeed when just a few are doing well at the top. it succeeds when the middle class gets bigger. our economy doesn't grow from the top down, it grows from the middle out. we don't believe that anybody is entitled to success in this country, but we do believe in opportunity. we believe in a country where hard work pays off and responsibility is rewarded and everybody is getting a fair shot and everybody is doing their fair share and everybody is playing by the same rules. that's the
we cannot afford another round of tax cuts for the wealthy. we can't afford to gut our investments in education or clean energy or research and technology. we can't afford to roll back regulations on wall street banks or oil companies or insurance companies. that is not a jobs plan. it's not a plan to grow our economy. it's sure not a plan to strengthen our middle class. we have been there, we have tried that. we're not going back, we are moving forward. we have got a different view about how...
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$5 trillion in tax cuts that he can't pay for? not if i've got anything to say about it. >>> plus, a tea party group accused of hovering and getting into faces is under fire. congressman cummings is demanding answers. he's here exclusively. >>> and live from new york, it's me, our friends at "snl" took on yours truly and the msnbc team. oh, yeah, i've got something to say about it. you're watching "politicsnation" on msnbc. >> it's a mile below the earth so for him, speaking to colorado was like being flown two miles into the air and having to give a speech in outer space. an intense burning sensation i woke up with this horrible rash on my right side. like somebody had set it on fire. and the doctor said, cindie, you have shingles. he said, you had chickenpox when you were a little girl... i said, yes, i did. i don't think anybody ever thinks they're going to get shingles. but it happened to me. for more of the inside story, visit shinglesinfo.com mom? who's mom? i'm the giants mascot. eat up! new jammin jerk chicken soup has tas
$5 trillion in tax cuts that he can't pay for? not if i've got anything to say about it. >>> plus, a tea party group accused of hovering and getting into faces is under fire. congressman cummings is demanding answers. he's here exclusively. >>> and live from new york, it's me, our friends at "snl" took on yours truly and the msnbc team. oh, yeah, i've got something to say about it. you're watching "politicsnation" on msnbc. >> it's a mile below the...
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so if the tax plan he described were a tax plan i was asked to support, i'd say absolutely not. i'm not looking for 5i trillion tax cut. i won't put in a place a tax cut that adds to the deficit. i'm not in favor of a $5 trillion tax cut. that's not my plan. >> that's three different moments during this debate when mitt romney noticed the bump in the set for obama. what he's saying there is he's arguing against math. the idea that you can cut faxes 20%, can you tell taxes for everybody and it's deficit neutral and faye for it by closing unspecified loop moles and dealing with deductions. that is the romney position. it's up to bahama to make romney get specific about it to say okay. it's easy to say you deal with the deductions and it's easy to say it's deficit neutral and let's talk about the specific deductions and talk about the home interest deduction and health care deduction and the charitable giving deduction. these are things that people rely on and things that are popular with voters. let's put mitt romney on the spot here and say if you pay for it with deductions, this
so if the tax plan he described were a tax plan i was asked to support, i'd say absolutely not. i'm not looking for 5i trillion tax cut. i won't put in a place a tax cut that adds to the deficit. i'm not in favor of a $5 trillion tax cut. that's not my plan. >> that's three different moments during this debate when mitt romney noticed the bump in the set for obama. what he's saying there is he's arguing against math. the idea that you can cut faxes 20%, can you tell taxes for everybody...
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. >> i'm not looking for a $5 trillion tax cut. what i've said is i won't put in place a tax cut that adds to the deficit. >> governor romney's central economic plan calls for a $5 trillion tax cut. for 18 months, he's been running on this tax plan. now, five weeks before the election, he's saying his big, bold idea is never mind. >> all right. what what's the deal here? >> this is a complicated one. we have from the romney campaign a plan that has been analyzed by an independent group that said it would lead to around $450 billion a year in revenue that's cut from the -- revenue that's not there as a result of these taxes. the obama campaign has then taken this and extrapolated it over ten years, and they have arrived at $5 trillion. well, ten years times $450 billion doesn't get us to $5 trillion. so that's not quite right. but what is true is that the romney campaign, governor romney himself, has not explained what they're going to do to make sure that this is revenue neutral, as he said. he says, and the campaign says, that the
. >> i'm not looking for a $5 trillion tax cut. what i've said is i won't put in place a tax cut that adds to the deficit. >> governor romney's central economic plan calls for a $5 trillion tax cut. for 18 months, he's been running on this tax plan. now, five weeks before the election, he's saying his big, bold idea is never mind. >> all right. what what's the deal here? >> this is a complicated one. we have from the romney campaign a plan that has been analyzed by an...
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>> he said for everybody, across the board. >> on top of the bush tax cuts? >> president obama during the debate said he is the one who is going to raise taxes by letting the bush tax cuts expire. >> but we just played two things back to back that do not match. >> look, he said all look, 20% across the board. i think there were two different things he was speaking about there. he has a very pro-growth policy. he has a policy to create 12 million jobs. >> so are you saying he misspoke in one of those? >> i'm not going to get into whether he misspoke or not -- what i know is he has said all along, 20% across the board for everybody, and that means everybody. to what specifically he was speaking there, i'm not exactly sure. but it's a clear choice what you have. we don't need to get caught up on the back and forth. he is going to put forward pro-growth jobs. and 7.8% is an anemic recovery. that is nothing to celebrate. i remember when president bush was criticized by president obama when i worked for him -- >> but for the past four years, republican have said sa
>> he said for everybody, across the board. >> on top of the bush tax cuts? >> president obama during the debate said he is the one who is going to raise taxes by letting the bush tax cuts expire. >> but we just played two things back to back that do not match. >> look, he said all look, 20% across the board. i think there were two different things he was speaking about there. he has a very pro-growth policy. he has a policy to create 12 million jobs. >> so...
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/ryan tax plan will raise taxes on middle-class families with a child, one or more children by an additional $2,000 a year. how -- all kidding aside, without the boos. stop all that malarkey. this is deadly ernest, man. this is deadly ernest. how they can justify -- how they can justify raising taxes on the middle class that's been buried the last four years. how in lord's name can they justify it? >> the romney campaign picked up on that middle class being buried for the last four years during which president obama was in the white house while campaigning in iowa. paul ryan did not miss the opportunity to seize on biden's choice of words. >> vice president biden just today said that the middle class over the last four years has been, quote, buried. we agree. of course the middle class has been buried. they're being buried by regulations. they're being buried by taxes. they're being buried by borrowing. they're being buried by the obama administration's economic failures. >> the romney campaign also chimed in on twitter writing agree with joe biden. the middle class has been buried the last
/ryan tax plan will raise taxes on middle-class families with a child, one or more children by an additional $2,000 a year. how -- all kidding aside, without the boos. stop all that malarkey. this is deadly ernest, man. this is deadly ernest. how they can justify -- how they can justify raising taxes on the middle class that's been buried the last four years. how in lord's name can they justify it? >> the romney campaign picked up on that middle class being buried for the last four years...
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they are right now, and then the other night he says, well, i don't want to actually cut the actual tax rate, i want to cut rates and then i want to increase deductions and give us effectively the same amount of taxes coming into the economy which leaves him with an unutterly incoherent record. with romney you have nothing and i think the message you will start hearing next week is going back to that old mondale commercial, where is the beef, show us the beef, because there ain't none there. >> john, before we eviscerate mitt romney entirely, he hasn't jumped on the bandwagon, though he did downplay the jobless rate, and he misstated the reason behind it. take a listen to this, john. >> the reason it's come down this year is primarily due to the fact that more and more people have just stopped looking for work. >> in fact, the unemployment rate fell because more people were working. i mean, this man's not capable of telling the truth about anything. >> well, he's actually correct in some past months but not in today's job. >> but he was speaking today. >> and so what he's doing now is h
they are right now, and then the other night he says, well, i don't want to actually cut the actual tax rate, i want to cut rates and then i want to increase deductions and give us effectively the same amount of taxes coming into the economy which leaves him with an unutterly incoherent record. with romney you have nothing and i think the message you will start hearing next week is going back to that old mondale commercial, where is the beef, show us the beef, because there ain't none there....
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and he opposes any new taxes. so on health care, he's kind of pulling up the ladder after him and his state. he's saying that he opposes universal health care at the federal level but he will not give states money they need to get it done at the state level. so under his plan there's no way to get universal health care done at all. but he doesn't really want you to know that. joining me now is jonathan gruber one of the folks who helped mitt romney design his health care law in massachusetts. it's great to see you. >> good to be here, ezra. >> you know these numbers for this plan, anything you want to fact check, correct or complicate here. >> no, you described it very well. i think what candidate romney is not owning up to is the fact that the federal government made our plan possible. they gave us the seed money, if you will, more than seed, more than half the money we needed to make it possible and the rest came from a tax that was already imposed on the state that mitt romney essentially rededicated to his eff
and he opposes any new taxes. so on health care, he's kind of pulling up the ladder after him and his state. he's saying that he opposes universal health care at the federal level but he will not give states money they need to get it done at the state level. so under his plan there's no way to get universal health care done at all. but he doesn't really want you to know that. joining me now is jonathan gruber one of the folks who helped mitt romney design his health care law in massachusetts....
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but he has said before that he wants to cut taxes for all americans the basis of his tax plan is that he wants to cut taxes for everyone. that, to me, was the most stunning one liner of the night, actually. >> yeah, i think so. but i also think, dana, it also stunning that you would stand up there and act like americans can't do math. i mean, you can't have a plan and then when the plan equals $5 trillion, you can't say, that's not what i'm saying. i mean, it is absolutely insulting to the american people. if you believe in a plan, if you believe if your plan is workable and doable and better than the president's, say, that argue it, and let the voters vote. but don't turn around and act like we're crazy because we heard what you've been saying for the last 18 months. >> right. obama is now in a position to nail jello to the wall. you said that romney was lying on wednesday night. now, that's possible or it's possible he's now telling the truth and the others were lies. you can't have a tax cut of that size and not add to the deficit because there are not enough loopholes to close to
but he has said before that he wants to cut taxes for all americans the basis of his tax plan is that he wants to cut taxes for everyone. that, to me, was the most stunning one liner of the night, actually. >> yeah, i think so. but i also think, dana, it also stunning that you would stand up there and act like americans can't do math. i mean, you can't have a plan and then when the plan equals $5 trillion, you can't say, that's not what i'm saying. i mean, it is absolutely insulting to...
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if they can't pay for it to provide the tax cut for the rich then they're going to raise taxes on the middle class. that's what the economic studies have shown. look, i don't know anybody who thinks we' we're another tax cu a millionaire away from a stronger middle class. >> watch ed schultz every night at 8:00 p.m. eastern on "the ed show" on msnbc. >>> a judge in pennsylvania has blocked the state's stricter voter inch d. law. ruling means that voters in pennsylvania will not have to show a state-approved i.d. to cast ballots on election day. the judge said he was concerned that the law could prevent some people from voting. the stricter voter i.d. laws in four states remain but tougher laws in at least six other states were either shelved or watered down, including those in a few swing states. >>> american airlines now says it knows why passenger seats broke loose causing a pair of emergency landings. they originally called for 8 of its aircraft to be inspected, later ordered 47 aircraft to be checked. they blame the problem on clamps that were not properly installed. they continue
if they can't pay for it to provide the tax cut for the rich then they're going to raise taxes on the middle class. that's what the economic studies have shown. look, i don't know anybody who thinks we' we're another tax cu a millionaire away from a stronger middle class. >> watch ed schultz every night at 8:00 p.m. eastern on "the ed show" on msnbc. >>> a judge in pennsylvania has blocked the state's stricter voter inch d. law. ruling means that voters in pennsylvania...
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tax hike. >> warren buffett will pay more in taxes. that sort of works but he never really got there. >> they think the same thing as what he said last week after he said that the middle class has been buried over the past four years. >> i just don't think people that are dumb. >> i will tell you, though, i would be willing to bet some money that the vice president will be much more effective in his debate with paul ryan than the president was in his debate with mitt romney because the vice president is used to getting beaten up. >> well, that's not a really high bar, is it, now. gene robinson, you wrote "obama's off night gives romney an opening." and i do think that joe biden has been out there and is used to getting beat up. and i think will do very well in the debate along with paul ryan. but your column, talking about obama's off night. can you help us out here? we're trying to figure out what happened to president obama. where was he? >> where was he? that's the question. it was really, you know, you kind of watched the thing unf
tax hike. >> warren buffett will pay more in taxes. that sort of works but he never really got there. >> they think the same thing as what he said last week after he said that the middle class has been buried over the past four years. >> i just don't think people that are dumb. >> i will tell you, though, i would be willing to bet some money that the vice president will be much more effective in his debate with paul ryan than the president was in his debate with mitt...
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any kind, an income tax increase. if you're going to have any kind of a long-term deal, a long-term dif set deal, which is what everybody -- not everybody, but a lot of people on both sides who say this is what they want. if you're going to, it will include a tax component on the wealthy. >> if obama campaigns on that and wins and if democrats hold the senate and make gains in the house, that could ratchet up pressure on republicans to make some kind of deal. otherwise, you have the other thing. it's a myth that nothing is going to happen in the lame duck, because if they take democrat off and congress doesn't show up, a lot will happen. december 31st, the expiration of the bush tax cuts. they go away if nothing happens. something ahas to happen. >> i find it extremely rich to hear john boehner talking about we can't do anything because for almost four years the gop strategy of obstruction has been to keep anything from happening. anything that obama wants, anything he's interested in, we must stop that and keep it fr
any kind, an income tax increase. if you're going to have any kind of a long-term deal, a long-term dif set deal, which is what everybody -- not everybody, but a lot of people on both sides who say this is what they want. if you're going to, it will include a tax component on the wealthy. >> if obama campaigns on that and wins and if democrats hold the senate and make gains in the house, that could ratchet up pressure on republicans to make some kind of deal. otherwise, you have the other...
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>> how they can justify, how they can justify raising taxes on the middle class that's been buried the last four years. >> vice president biden just today said that the middle class over the last four years has been, quote, buried. we agree. that means we need to stop digging by electing mitt romney the next president of the united states! >> today, heavy hitters are fighting back. senator marco rubio just now in denver. >> the last four years the american middle class has been buried. those aren't my words. those happened to be the words of the distinguished vice president of the united states, mr. joe biden. no, don't boo. he's the best thing we got going, guys. >> and how's this for trail mix? mitt romney got more than he bargained for when he posed at chipotle after ordering a burrito bowl in a photo op that's an internet sensation. good day, andrea mitchell live in denver at the site of tonight's presidential debate, the first time in five years that barack obama and mitt romney are going to be face-to-face in what the local newspaper is headlining as the duel in denver. joining m
>> how they can justify, how they can justify raising taxes on the middle class that's been buried the last four years. >> vice president biden just today said that the middle class over the last four years has been, quote, buried. we agree. that means we need to stop digging by electing mitt romney the next president of the united states! >> today, heavy hitters are fighting back. senator marco rubio just now in denver. >> the last four years the american middle class...
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plan. >> this was dishonest. >> i'm not in favor of a $5 trillion tax cut. >> the governor knows his $5 trillion tax cut isn't too popular, so a few weeks before the election, he's trying to pretend it doesn't exist. >> reporter: president obama at a star-studded fundraising concert in los angeles sunday heads to san francisco today with romney's poll numbers improving. >> they're looking very good. i feel very good. >> reporter: after the debate, romney is within two points of the president. and tomorrow, both candidates head to ohio, battleground ohio, where early voting is already under way. tomorrow is the last day to register to vote there. veronica? >> thank you. mitt romney will deliver that major policy speech before noon eastern, but the obama campaign is issuing a preemptive strike with this new tv ad criticizing the republican candidate's past foreign policy faux pas. take a look. >> reckless. amateurish. that's what news media and fellow republicans called mitt romney's gaffe-filled july tour of england, israel, and poland, when our u.s. diplomats were attacked in libya,
plan. >> this was dishonest. >> i'm not in favor of a $5 trillion tax cut. >> the governor knows his $5 trillion tax cut isn't too popular, so a few weeks before the election, he's trying to pretend it doesn't exist. >> reporter: president obama at a star-studded fundraising concert in los angeles sunday heads to san francisco today with romney's poll numbers improving. >> they're looking very good. i feel very good. >> reporter: after the debate, romney is...
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the cut in tax rates? >> the cut in tax rates is lower all americans tax rate business 20%. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> unless you take away the deductions. >> we're going to get to that in a second. the first half lowering the tax rates does that cost $5 trillion? >> no. look, i won't get into baseline argument with you because that's what a lot of this is about. lowering tax rates broadening the tax base works and you can -- >> but i have to -- you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go through all of the math. >> that was paul ryan on fox news yesterday making the case against math or for time or some combination thereof. these are the moments where i think the romney team has trouble, once you can actually drill down and say, but how does it work? show me the numbers. there is no answer. >> right. paul ryan thinks he can use this kind of policy wonk construction that he's been able to create to evade policy discussions. h
the cut in tax rates? >> the cut in tax rates is lower all americans tax rate business 20%. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> unless you take away the deductions. >> we're going to get to that in a second. the first half lowering the tax rates does that cost $5 trillion? >> no. look, i won't get into baseline argument with you because that's what a lot of this is about. lowering tax rates broadening the tax base works and you can --...
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cuts, going beyond the extension of the bush tax cuts. he talks about raising defense spending. he rejects a 10 to one ratio of spending cuts to tax increases. simpson-bowles. you mentioned them. they say the math doesn't add up in the romney plan and he won't tell us how he thinks it does. >> well, listen. the country is hungry for bipartisan compromise, david. i agree with you,t( especially after the last four year was intense partisanship from this white house. and mitt romney is the only candidate in this race who has a record of showing he knows as an executive how to forge bipartisan compromise. as the governor of massachusetts, over 85% of his legislature democrats, he made things happen. and he will make things happen as president of the united states. and will forge the right type of compromise to get this done. and that's the way it's going to work. >> do you think that this governor romney should be in a situation where he's actually prepared to deal with revenue, to raise revenue, go against his party if it's part of a package
cuts, going beyond the extension of the bush tax cuts. he talks about raising defense spending. he rejects a 10 to one ratio of spending cuts to tax increases. simpson-bowles. you mentioned them. they say the math doesn't add up in the romney plan and he won't tell us how he thinks it does. >> well, listen. the country is hungry for bipartisan compromise, david. i agree with you,t( especially after the last four year was intense partisanship from this white house. and mitt romney is the...
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that means probably raising taxes or at least cutting some loopholes and making the tax code simpler, raising revenue, making some investments but maybe curbing entitlements. >> i want to bring in ralph nader, three-time presidential candidate and author of the new book called "the 17 solutions." always good to have you on the program. thanks for being here. mitt romney is painting himself as a defender of the middle class. he says he won't raise taxes on the middle class, won't cut education. has a plan to cover people with pre-existing conditions. is this the real mitt romney? give us your take on this economic debate. >> it's clearly the new fake romney on the debate and president obama couldn't adjust in time. he said what's this? and i think it's the old romney that counts. i think the 47% really reflected his plutocratic personality, and he still has tattend to his bas, which is the primary base. that's what's going to bring him down. >> that's the political reality. there is a reality that there are people out there who want to know what these guys are going to do going forward
that means probably raising taxes or at least cutting some loopholes and making the tax code simpler, raising revenue, making some investments but maybe curbing entitlements. >> i want to bring in ralph nader, three-time presidential candidate and author of the new book called "the 17 solutions." always good to have you on the program. thanks for being here. mitt romney is painting himself as a defender of the middle class. he says he won't raise taxes on the middle class, won't...
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when you compare the top marginal income tax rate, the tax rate that top earners get taxed over the highest threshold with employment, growth happens when taxes are higher, not lower. let me show you a chart that the president could have used this week to simplify the whole debate. this is what the election boils down to right here. larry bartels' chart makes it clear, under democratic presidents, everyone does better, even the very top. talk about trickle-down big government but more importantly, americans are ready to move on, even before the good news job numbers were released, an nbc/"wall street journal" survey showed that 44% of americans believe the economy will improve in the next year and four in ten say the country is headed in the right direction, the highest percentage on this question since june of 2009. here with me is cnbc contributor, dan dicker, a 25-year trading veteran of the new york mercantile exchange, civil right attorney mya wiley. attorney raul ruiz and a contributor to "the nation" magazine. thank you for being here. let me ask a question, does 7.8% wipe away wedne
when you compare the top marginal income tax rate, the tax rate that top earners get taxed over the highest threshold with employment, growth happens when taxes are higher, not lower. let me show you a chart that the president could have used this week to simplify the whole debate. this is what the election boils down to right here. larry bartels' chart makes it clear, under democratic presidents, everyone does better, even the very top. talk about trickle-down big government but more...
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i was going to ask you the taxes issue. having the democrat lead on taxes can't be good for a republican. >> we had the second cycle in a row where obama's run and tried to neutralize a tax advantage. again, part of it and thas is what is really new to our poling. more afffluent people think obama is the biggest threat to them. lower income people think mitt romney is. we are seeing cultural differences by income that are interesting. >> the romney quality advantages what i want to do with you federal budget deficit up nine. dealing with china as an economic rival up eight. on the economy up three. changing business as usual in washington is dead even. if you are the obama campaign what concerns you the most here? the deficit number? >> probably the deficit. i think if you are the president's campaign you're less worried about romney's numbers right now. on the one hand the 40% right direction is the highest it has been in 3 1/2 years and any incumbent heading in that is momentum. 53% say the country is headed in the wrong
i was going to ask you the taxes issue. having the democrat lead on taxes can't be good for a republican. >> we had the second cycle in a row where obama's run and tried to neutralize a tax advantage. again, part of it and thas is what is really new to our poling. more afffluent people think obama is the biggest threat to them. lower income people think mitt romney is. we are seeing cultural differences by income that are interesting. >> the romney quality advantages what i want to...
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the cut in tax rates. >> the cut in tax rates is lower all american tax rates by 20%. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> it's not revenue neutral unless you take away the deductions. we're going to get to that. >> lowering tax rates by broadening the tax base works. and you can -- >> but you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go through all of the math. >> what's your response to that answer, steve, just the whole series of back and forth there? >> i think that really that's the wrong argument to have if you're paul ryan. >> what do you mean that's the wrong argument? he's the numbers guy. he's the fiscal responsible face of the republican party, what other -- is he supposed to be on the front line for foreign policy? this was supposed to be his game. why is that the wrong argument? >> i didn't say it was the wrong issue. i said the wrong argument. those are two different things. >> okay. >> to me he's accepting the premise of the questions that taxing and spending and how big the government is and the role of
the cut in tax rates. >> the cut in tax rates is lower all american tax rates by 20%. >> how much does that cost? >> it's revenue neutral. >> it's not revenue neutral unless you take away the deductions. we're going to get to that. >> lowering tax rates by broadening the tax base works. and you can -- >> but you haven't given me the math. >> well, i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go through all of the math. >> what's your...
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did the vice president give critics an opening when he talked about a tax hike. let's listen. >> you know the phrase they always use? obama and biden want to raise taxes by a trillion dollars. guess what? yes, we do, in one regard. we want to let that $1 trillion tax cut expire so the middle class doesn't have to bear the burden of all the money going to the super-wealthy. >> does the vice president's style create a risk for the democratic ticket? >> he does. you know, it's something that they've been watching with joe biden for years, but joe biden has been preparing for an entire week. by thursday when the debate happens, he will have spent almost a week at his home in wilmington preparing. and when he is prepared, he is much better in that he doesn't make those same gaffes. when he nose what it is that he needs to say and he's not going off the cuff in this style, he does better. >> on thursday, joe biden went aggressively after governor romney on taxes. let's take a look at that. >> you just never know what game or what position governor romney's going to com
did the vice president give critics an opening when he talked about a tax hike. let's listen. >> you know the phrase they always use? obama and biden want to raise taxes by a trillion dollars. guess what? yes, we do, in one regard. we want to let that $1 trillion tax cut expire so the middle class doesn't have to bear the burden of all the money going to the super-wealthy. >> does the vice president's style create a risk for the democratic ticket? >> he does. you know, it's...
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i don't have a tax plan that is 4.8 trillion, i am not going to cut taxes on the rich. i don't have a voucher plan, i love teachers, i think we need more of them. don't believe me, speaker gingrich was eloquent in the primaries, saying that mitt romney will say absolutely anything to get elected. >> the president had 90 minutes, now, if he had done his homework and prepared, if he had actually studied romney, why didn't he say it? virtually every analyst has said, and even your deputy campaign manager has said the charges -- was made wrong. forgetting that for a second, the job of the president is supposed to be able to be competent and to stand up for what he believes in and articulate what is wrong. mitt romney walked over him. >> and alex, you mentioned the president is air born to the golden state, a star studded concert with katy perry, and tuesday, campaigning in ohio, meanwhile, mitt romney had a rally last night in florida and stays in florida for a second day, more campaign events later in that swing state. >> yeah, i think you left out george clooney, because
i don't have a tax plan that is 4.8 trillion, i am not going to cut taxes on the rich. i don't have a voucher plan, i love teachers, i think we need more of them. don't believe me, speaker gingrich was eloquent in the primaries, saying that mitt romney will say absolutely anything to get elected. >> the president had 90 minutes, now, if he had done his homework and prepared, if he had actually studied romney, why didn't he say it? virtually every analyst has said, and even your deputy...
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about lowering taxes isn't as attractive to them. therefore i'm not likely to draw them into my campaign. >> joining me now is karen finney former communications director for the dnc and msnbc analyst. karen, great to have you with us. >> good to see you, ed. >> was it a brilliant strategy on the part of the obama team for the president not to use the 47% remark to give an opening to mitt romney because a huge platform of 60 some plus million people. what about that? >> you know, that may very well be. i mean, the thing that, although that is so insulting is, think about it. just the clip you just played, the night that came out, the next day where did he go? fox news. with neil cavuto. again, he really stood by those comments. he said, well, i could have said them a little better but i really stand by the message. for the last two weeks he has been saying i stand by this message that those people, you know, that language, even in his ads he talks about those people, that they wouldn't be attracted to his message of lower taxes? i me
about lowering taxes isn't as attractive to them. therefore i'm not likely to draw them into my campaign. >> joining me now is karen finney former communications director for the dnc and msnbc analyst. karen, great to have you with us. >> good to see you, ed. >> was it a brilliant strategy on the part of the obama team for the president not to use the 47% remark to give an opening to mitt romney because a huge platform of 60 some plus million people. what about that? >>...
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president tried to get him on that on the $5 trillion tax cut thing. i'm not sure he effectively pinned him down on that though the obama campaign was spinning that they did. >> i think they made a mistake on that issue, the obama people did, by going with the $5 trillion. because that, you know, policy wonks can debate whether it amounts to $5 trillion or not. what they can't debate, it's a 20% tax reduction for the wealthiest americans. that is a plain irrefutable fact and if they used that, it would, first of all, explain more what this is, which is a tax cut for the wealthy which was one of several points the president wasn't able to actually convey in a clear way. and would also be, you know, be on dispute factually. >> and when a -- sorry, go ahead. >> no. >> when paul ryan spoke at the republican convention, the first reaction was, wow, young fresh guy, so handsome. you know, there's like -- an immediate positive response. later that night, that same evening in the same news cycle, the sort of second breath response was, wow, there are a lot of
president tried to get him on that on the $5 trillion tax cut thing. i'm not sure he effectively pinned him down on that though the obama campaign was spinning that they did. >> i think they made a mistake on that issue, the obama people did, by going with the $5 trillion. because that, you know, policy wonks can debate whether it amounts to $5 trillion or not. what they can't debate, it's a 20% tax reduction for the wealthiest americans. that is a plain irrefutable fact and if they used...